Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008, 15:08 (GMT) Post subject:
here's an example of great advertising, it changed this drink into one of the most popular in France. it's from 1995 and people still talk about this ad. No one will ever forget the brand name (or shape).
You don't need to understand French to get it, but here's the translation anyway:
-what's my line?
-Ah
-mm?
-Aaaahhhh!!!!!
same player, play again - shake it!
_________________ Claire Dodin voix off / French voice talent
www.clairedodin.com SaVoa No. 07022
Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008, 15:44 (GMT) Post subject:
Sid Whatley wrote:
As a former partner in a national ad agency going to early morning creative sessions, I can tell ya that SERIOUS thought, consultation, research, auditions and weeks of work go into producing those silly (stupid) ads. They just don't "happen". Every bit of copy, movement, camera angle, lighting, voiceover and music composition (my dept) is carefully & meticulously created.
This is just my semi-ignorant opinion, but I believe that, to a certain extent, this sort of research is an attempt to inject science where it doesn't necessarily apply. I'm not suggesting that market research or psychological studies are not valid tools, but I think some advertisers or agencies are so in love with their focus groups and their statistics that they try to apply a scientific formula to everything -- including the creative process that is largely visceral.
A lot of very effective advertising is the result of a combination of human creativity, experience, and common sense. I would be willing to guess that the bulk of the over-analyzing is a result of trying to scientifically re-create the results from some fabulously successful ad that was generated the old-fashioned way.
Diane Havens wrote:
It was YEARS before I bought Charmin toilet paper -- I couldn't get over the insulting "please don't squeeze the Charmin" ads from long ago. It's perfectly good toilet paper, by the way. Or "ring around the collar" for Wisk -- hated that one. I PURPOSELY avoided those perfectly good products because I found their ads silly and moronic, and I didn't want to support or associate with them.
Association is very important in advertising. You want to be part of that "club" created by the brand -- or you DON'T.
I have knowingly ever eaten only one Lay's potato chip. Way back when they began their "Bet you can't eat one" ad campaign I decided to take them up on the challenge. I realize this is just a personal quirk of mine and not the average citizen's reaction to advertising. But in some other cases, I believe my reaction to commercials is similar to that of a normal person.
For example, Burger King's creepy King character wierds me out to the extent that I might think twice about eating there. And the king is not nearly as off-putting as the ill conceived "Herb" character they tried several years ago. I believe that campaign carried an unintended subliminal message that Burger King was the preferred franchise for guys like Herb and Herb was an unmitigated loser, so, therefore, Burger King is for losers and if I eat there I'm a loser, too.
On the other hand, Wisk is the classic case of an ad campaign that was overwhelmingly successful despite -- or perhaps even because it was so annoying. But the secret to its success was not merely the annoyance factor. It had a real message that it conveyed simply. Anybody who has ever been hot and sweaty and has removed a shirt has seen that nasty dirt inside the collar. Ring around the collar was a more or less universal "problem" and Wisk portrayed itself as the solution.
Besides, what made the Wisk ads so annoying was not necessarily the ads themselves but the frequency with which we were exposed to them. And that constancy of message was the other key to their effectiveness. _________________ For more voice over demos, my life story, and other foolishness, please visit my website at www.leegordonproductions.com
Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008, 20:07 (GMT) Post subject:
Well that may be, Lee.
But the Wisk commercial, annoying enough just for the nyah-nyah song of the tormenting shirts, was sexist as well. The collars were all of men's shirts and the washers of said shirts were all women, as I recall. They had to endure not only their husbands' grimy laundry -- they had to be subjected to those same shirts taunting them about their failure to eradicate the dreaded rings of filth! The only way to quiet them was with WISK!!!
I found it all very distasteful. Even in those Betty Crocker times. _________________ Diane
Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008, 21:10 (GMT) Post subject:
sex! lies!!! and advertising !!!
keeping on track w/ creative ads, sumo wrestlers and my house painting trade:
this niffty Nippon Paint commercial was posted on the Professional House Painters Forum i frequent ...
it targets the DIY market, and the demand for low VOC (volatile organic compounds) and low odor coatings ... and its not sexist.. unless you count the sumo wrestlers pert buttocks..
_________________ "the woods would be very silent if no birds sang except those that sang best."
Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008, 21:22 (GMT) Post subject:
The old guy on page one of this thread seems easy to do laundry for. No ring around that collar! And that bag he's wearing is quite stylish. I'll take him. Summos scare me. Oh, wait. What?
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008, 18:08 (GMT) Post subject: Hmm research
I couldn't possibly disagree with Lee Gordon any more.
A part of his previous statement about "attempting to inject science where it doesn't apply", doesn't just show a lack of understanding advertising and marketing, but perhaps a failure to utilize one's senses properly as they simply go about day-to-day activities.
You may disagree with what a good or bad ad is, but for a financial company to spend 12+ million dollars on a marketing campaign and as a result lose 16 billion dollars in stock value represents BAD COMMERCIAL.
This was created by someone who strictly plowed ahead the old fashioned way with a clever idea and paid no attention to the data collection or core values of the target audience. They wanted to be innovative and break ground.
Yes this happened, and there are many other stories. Why didn't AskJeeves retain it's position as the #1 search engine? How could they possibly allow upstart Google to knock them not just down a peg, but completely out of commission? Simply a failure to act upon the data and instead bow to the will of a relatively small group of individuals who thoght they knew better.
How the heck did Sony, who owned the market with Walkmen wind up NOT being the company to develop the "de rigeur" solid state personal device and instead let this bsuiness go to Apple, a company who was practically on it's last legs prior to the IPod?
Sometimes, despite the best amount of planning and strategizing, somethng will fall flat on its face, but there can and often are other circumstances that lead to the failure.
As a mentor of mine said "Homeless people probably didn't get that way as a result of carefull planning"
Yes, there are the odd cases here and there and that's what makes life so much fun. There are no guarantys and even in math and science, we ocassionally will bear witness to a paradigm shift.
Perhaps one can say that science shouldn't have gotten involved with astronomy or is it science fault that Pluto is no longer a planet.
There simply is no such thing as over-analyzing. It is this attention to the habits and value systems of groups of individuals, which categorize their habits and patterns into ever tighter and tighter market segments that allows for the creation of targeted content that "speaks" to that individual.
I'm sorry, but the Judy Garland/ Mickey Rooney approach of you've got a barn and I can dance... only seems to work in the movies. Perhaps what makes it difficult to really understand is how much of it works on real gut levels and is directed by very behind the scenes mechanisms.
This analyzing of likes and dislikes is leading us into a new era of push advertising, as exhibited by You Tbe and similar sites, whereby people actually request to see advertising. I beleive that's easily demonstrated by the several examples on this thread alone.
This data collection has led to several marketing sites, most notably Amazone now being able to suggest gifts for me that are in 98% of all cases dead on. Of course, my friends and family do it the "old-fashioned way", which more often than not results in me pretending to like the gift as it isn't even remotely something i would want to own.
So while the PD's at radio stations, who more often than not can't seem to properly form a sentence go on doing things the "old fashioned way", I'll keep on takng briefs and researching the market and develop a competitive analysis and look at trends and data and web analytics and anything else I can do that allows me to craft a message that speaks to the intended audience in their language.
As a creative director myself, sometimes I want to plow ahead with some incredible idea, but when you follow the data it might ocassionally tell you that the best creative mesdsage turns out to be one that isn't necessarily all that creative.
And like most of advertising, much of what I do isn't all that good or bad, but it usually is effective.
Posted: Sun Jul 13, 2008, 02:20 (GMT) Post subject:
Oh and Lee...I just wanted to thank you for posting that fabulous ad from the 60's!!! I LOVED that ad. (Yes, remember I'm old enough to have seen it.) That's AWESOME that you found that. It left you just wanting to touch that guy's silky-smooth-shaven face! (Maybe I'm revealing a little too much here...)
To me, that was a very cool use of sexy innuendo and humor, without showing a woman sliding down a pole! THAT was a well done ad. (And of course the smokin' hot guy didn't hurt.....)
However the idea of "footage" of an actual stripper in a home-buyers ad is just so....well.....ludicrous!
Posted: Sun Jul 13, 2008, 08:59 (GMT) Post subject:
Believe it or not, I don't disagree with JS at all. I fully understand and recognize the importance of research and analysis in the use and application of advertising. In fact, I'm pretty sure that Burger King, in my previous example, would have saved themselves millions of not only wasted but counter-productive advertising dollars if they had they been more diligent in testing their "Herb" campaign.
Perhaps I didn't state it clearly enough, but when I referred to "injecting science where it doesn't apply" I was talking about expecting there to be some magic scientific formula that will actually substitute for the human creative process. Before all the number crunching and testing and analyzing can take place, there has to be at least some plain old unfettered idea-mongering. If the research then suggests that the idea is not going to fly or needs to be tweaked, then it's back to the drawing board for the necessary adjustments, but we can't expect some computer print-out to actually come up with and flesh out the ideas themselves. At least I hope not. _________________ For more voice over demos, my life story, and other foolishness, please visit my website at www.leegordonproductions.com
i put in your name and it created a new slogan for you.. guaranteed to make you more money in the VO biz:
Lee Gordon for a brighter shine.
it may not "actually come up with and flesh out the ideas themselves", but, damn !!! those algorithm poindexters will stop at nothing to replace the human brain so they can kick back on a beach eatin chips and drinkin beer !! _________________ "the woods would be very silent if no birds sang except those that sang best."
Posted: Sun Jul 13, 2008, 13:38 (GMT) Post subject:
Seriously, good advertising involves a thorough understanding of psychology and how people make decisions.
I know I've recommended this book before, but I must throw it out there again. It's an enjoyable read as well. BLINK: The Power of Thinking Without Thinking, by Malcolm Gladwell. Such great examples in it range from predicting which newly married couples will still be married ten years from now to explaining why Coke screwed up its analysis of the "Pepsi challenge" market research data with its disastrous introduction of New Coke. _________________ Diane
Posted: Sun Jul 13, 2008, 16:28 (GMT) Post subject:
Diane Havens wrote:
Seriously, good advertising involves a thorough understanding of psychology and how people make decisions.
And yet, even with that knowledge there's no guarantee that the advertising will be memorable or effective. It's like hit songs. There is no set of specifications you can employ that will guarantee you can create a commercial -- or a song -- that will resonate with the public to such a degree that it will soar to the top of the charts.
There is knowledge you can have or techniques you can employ that may give you better odds of success but I believe there always remains that tiny little magical element in any creative endeavor that can't be quantified or summoned on demand. Every once in a while, it just happens.
And Diane, your Coke example is exactly what I was referring to when I first mentioned "injecting science where it does not belong." I can see now that I probably misspoke and should have said "applying science inappropriately or incompletely." The executives at Coke were so hell-bent on countering Pepsi and plunged ahead with the creation of "new Coke."
I'm sure they developed the new flavor using all the scientific techniques that are appropriate for that process and came up with the best "new Coke" flavor they could. And I'm sure they did exhaustive taste testing among all the candidates to become new Coke. And yet that science was ill applied because it wasn't preceded by asking the right fundamental questions. _________________ For more voice over demos, my life story, and other foolishness, please visit my website at www.leegordonproductions.com
Last edited by Lee Gordon on Sun Jul 13, 2008, 17:23 (GMT); edited 1 time in total
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